Picture credit RGF
Aliya speaks in Sports Express
http://news.sport-express.ru/2014-05-18/699607
I am very pleased with my performance today, I don't know what the judges didn't like about my bars, but I didn't ask them ... I did my routine fairly well without serious error.
On beam I didn't have the start value but I received the highest execution score. We will try to fix that before the World Championships.
Considering the problems I had with my ankle, I think I performed to the optimum at the moment. I did everything I could.
I'm not the least bit sorry that I performed here - Very glad that I could help the team. I think my presence made things easier for the girls. It is very difficult to compete at such serious senior competitions for the first time. Of course they were very worried. But I'm sure that with time they will learn to cope easily with their nerves (smiles).
I do believe that you deserved the gold medal on bars Aliya, but the judges who suffer from "gymnastics correctness" gave 8.9 E-score to Downie who muscled every inch of her routine (personally I wouldn't give her more than 8.4 for that routine)
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Deleteagree , Downia has amazing difficulty on bars but no way she has the same execution as Mustafina !!!! NO WAY . however am happy for both of them and I am always a big fan of Aliya. God bless this girl and her AMAZING help and support to the russian team. As Alexandrov said " V. Rodionenko should kiss Aliya's feet "
ReplyDeleteJust because Downie does not have a great fluidity and sense does not mean her exectuion should be that much lower. I don't think muscling is a deduction as long as their is no dead hang. Plus her muscling isn't that bad. She is just more aggressive with the bars. Downie sticks to her strengths, releases, which do not require a great sense of rhythm like pirouettes, which is why Mustafina has many Pirouettes and Downie does not.
ReplyDelete"fluidity" is the most important thing on this specific piece of apparatus it's not FX or VT, and if you does not have great fluidity on bars then you don't deserve a high E-score as much as 8.9 ... that's my opinion.
DeleteOh, I see. At first I thought you meant she should have by the code. I like to see variety in the sport. Just like how good floor routines can be unique and contrast (Fragapanes awesome modern routine and Mustafina's balletic style) I think good bar routines can have different styles. Daredevils like Downie Seitz and Tweddle, and graceful/fluid ones like Mustafina and Scheder. Gymnastics should be a diverse sport and encourage different style in a gymnast's work. It is what makes each individual different. That is just how I feel.
DeleteI always remeber Alexandrov....Valentina must kiss Alyia´s feet. She is he vertical column holding the team and medals of Russia.
DeleteTo be frank, that interview made me cringe a bit. I read it in Russian. There was nothing the judges 'didn't like' about Aliya's bars, in fact her score was higher than both quals and team finals and all routines were pretty similar. She sounds a bit bitter 'don't know what they didn't like, I didn't go over and ask. everything was clean'. Rebecca on the other hand fully deserved her title, not only did she perform a stunning routine but it was also 0.3 higher than Alka in start value (yes Valentina, you got your mathematics wrong again) and a 0.4 upgrade on her quals D score! Aliya played safe, simple as that. And rightfully so, no need to aggravate that injury and under the circumstances she did terrific work.
ReplyDeleteAliya was replying to a journalist's question about what the judges didn't like about her routine. She most probably wouldn't have independently chosen this line, especially as she congratulated and embraced Beckie right before the British gymnast's score was even announced!
DeleteThank QE - that was my interpretation of events as I saw them also. I noticed Aliya did not watch much of Becky's routine - she knew she was likely to be beaten if Downie hit and was fine with it and happy to have met her own expectations. Do gymnasts/ coaches get some kind of breakdown of their E score after the event by the way? Poor Aliya to be thrown such provocative questions - great that she can shrug it off with such humour!
Deleteit's obvious that she talks about the E-score not D-score, and in terms of E-score no chance for Downie to get near aliya and that's the bottom line ...
ReplyDeleteBoth of their routines were pretty clean and this was reflected in the scores. Becky did what she had to do and respect to her for having that ability to up the game - yes, it is a shame that Aliya was not able to respond on this occasion...
DeleteNo they weren't both clean, Downie muscled her whole routine and didn't hit any handstand ...
DeleteMust have watched a diff routine to you then because downie hit most if her handstands and I actually thought the better routine won
DeleteNo I can assure you that saw the right one, and I stay firm that she overscored a lot and no chance that she has the same execution as Mustafina the UB Olympic Champion ...
DeleteJohn
And morever, t’s well known that the more difficult you go the more possibility of deduction you will encounter...
DeleteThe funny thing that Downie performed 6.2 D-score in qualification and TF and granted 8.9 and 8.633 respectively but when she went for a more difficult set 6.6 (more than her previous set by four tenths!!) she got a huge 8.9 E-score, is that reasonable and if so give me one example to such an incident to gymnast who performed much higher D-set by 4.0 IN THE SAME CHAMPIONSHIP and still got the same E-score of his lower routine…
John
Aliya had a higher e-score and beckys d-score was .3 higher and have you seen aliyas build up to her dismount its almost as bad as her twisting form, I think shes a lovely gymnast but her routine was not as good as ay the olympics and becky more than deserved the title
DeleteYou say Becky did not hit any handstand, but she only had 2 pirouetting elements. I actually thought those weren't too bad either. Her casts were not bad either, and the code is more lenient of the degree your cast to handstand has to be.
DeleteFirst, that's not an answer to the point I have addressed.
DeleteSecond, you still didn't give me and example.
Third, Downie UBF is higher than hers in Q and TF by 0.4 (sorry I miss typed it 4.0) please check the results book. 6.2 and 6.6 so it's 0.4
john
Well the .4 came from only adding a extra release and connectin it to her pac I really dont understand your problem john I also dont understand how you can think you know more than the judges are you a judge or coach??
Delete1.so it turned to be 0.4 not 0.3 as you said before ...
Delete2.I didn't ask you where these 0.4 came from I have simply asked you if you have ever seen a gymnast who upgraded that much in the same championship and still got a high execution like 8.9 without letting much space for errors and asked you to give me an example and apparently you don't have one.
3.you have the same cliche "you are not a judge" well neither you apparently but I have my opinion based on what I see and think and yes I have the right to differ with anyone on any topic or any result that I don't think it's fair.
Well I don't have to answer someone who calls anyone names like "sour grapes" and if anyone doesn't like my opinion then it's his problem not mine and you have to live with that ...
DeleteJohn
Im actually an ex gymnast and also a coach and she only added anither move an connected it with the pac so why would she loose much on execution?she could have hit 1 more handstand in finals than she did any other day and that would make up for adding with dscore, I mean its not like the judges are going to over score a gymnast from gbr
DeleteThe golden medal was won by Becky. End of story. Neither or you can change that. I'm sure Aliya will have a lot of chances to win other medals.
DeleteTo Svetlana: and I still believe in what I said and you can't change that, thx
DeleteJohn
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Delete'Criticism has played a vital part in the evolution of the sport'. That is an interesting idea. Can you elaborate on it? Let us take the discussion forward. Examples anyone?
DeleteJust to be clear, I was never saying the judges were wrong in the case of Aliya and Rebecca as it seems thats what you think I'm referring to. What I disagreed with is saying that judges cant get it wrong or that people cant criticize them simply because they're highly trained/experienced. Yes theres a system inplace for their errors but not for everything. I was never arguing for Downie's scores whether e or d.
DeleteI never meant it as a personal attack. I thought I was being respectful in my arguments i.e. no namecalling or saying you cant have an opinion because youre not an expert by definition.
@Queen Elizabeth The biggest example I can thonk of right now is the change from the old code in big part because of the judging controversies with Nemov and Yang. The judges faced a lot of criticisms then the FIG/OC was even taken to court for Yang.
Delete@Jay Jaxon I appreciate your different opinion on Downie’s score.
DeleteHowever, about the judging I think we share a similar notion which is we have the right to disagree with the judges, because some people deny that right in the pretext of “they are highly qualified” and “you are not a judge” …
you provided an example of the inquiry issue in the past few years, but I can add the following:
1. How many times in the recent years the spectators booed a score of a certain gymnast, and it’s increasing phenomenon, like what happened after POPA Roxana’s score in UBF, and I’m sure that we can recall moments like that in worlds and Olympics.
2. If I’m not qualified judge, what about the discrepancy among the “qualified judges” themselves, and I think we all aware of the atrocity around the discrepancy between the E- jury panel and Execution Reference panel in the last Olympics which ER gives the gold to komova not Douglas and gold to Maroney not Izbasa (so if it’s a matter of “highly qualified” then the ER panel score should rule!!!) , so it’s simple: different judges, different score and outcome not like chemistry same ingredient and same condition, you get the same outcome, I mean the results in sport is in the realm of relativism …
3. The FIG admits that there are biased judges and I quote “a handful of judges have also been formally reprimanded for erroneous judging, or judging that favored a certain gymnast or country” read the following link for more information:
https://www.fig-gymnastics.com/site/figNews/view?id=337
And after reading you will find that there’s no transparency as it gives you no information about those judges’ names and countries, and the gymnasts/countries they have favored and how their favoritism affected the results and the medals… so how can I trust something like that??
John
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DeletePlease note, all of Heather's comments and those mentioning her name in full have been removed at her request and she has been blocked.
DeleteGood for her, she did really well and I'm sure her presence helped the team. She is right the other girls did well for their first really serious competition and hopefully with more competitions it will help with their nerves. Now she needs to go get that ankle look after and not aggravate it anymore. I don't want her to have the same problems as Komova with her ankle.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon, she doesn't sound bitter, I think she is saying, she isn't sure what else she would need to do better to get her E scores in the 9's that is all.
Spot on M
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ReplyDeletehttp://rewritingrussiangymnastics.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/rrg-community-standards-and.html
Before I came here, I didn't know that Alia had won individual medals. I am very happy for her, though I do worry about her ankles. I hope she gets good treatment and that she is allowed to rest and fully recover.
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